You are an unregistered user, you can register here
Navigation

Information

Site

Donations
If you wish to make a donation you can by clicking the image below.


 
Go Back   The Unreal Admins Page > Forums > Hosted Forums > UTAN > General Chat

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Unread 8th September, 2006, 02:52 PM
url-sephiroth's Avatar
url-sephiroth url-sephiroth is offline
Dominating
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: uk
Posts: 120
Default

i have to agree with ARsEnAl51 on that might asweel face the fact that ut2004 is screwed epic are not going to do any real work to sort it out and the only why to sort out the problem is to set something up like strem login + password to play online & and i dont see epic doing anything like that ...do u?
  #22  
Unread 8th September, 2006, 08:37 PM
AndyMc-IceMan AndyMc-IceMan is offline
Rampage
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 76
Default

It was said about clients needing something client side, I suppose this would be to complete a negotiation between utan server and client to verify the client. On this point does UTAN supply the welcome page on entry to the server listing in the game?

Also locking out some ISP's may force them to deal with the offenders on there network or face being banned as an ISP from a certain game.
Seems hash but a good idea IMO. If a big company feels they are too big to sort people like BFH then hit there pockets and watch them suddenly deal with the problems.
I think that out of all anti-cheat ideas ever mentioned this has to be the BEST EVER so far, and it will ahcieve much more than any anti-cheat systam is able to. But I do think live updating of Anti-Cheat systems would be a good addition. Especially with the registration system aswell.

Also Azura yes that was very well laided out what you said and will be a very good reference for many.

Last edited by AndyMc-IceMan : 8th September, 2006 at 08:40 PM.
  #23  
Unread 9th September, 2006, 12:29 AM
ShaD` ShaD` is offline
Killing Spree
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 25
Default

About wormbo's text, love to hear this m8!

For the rest i have the same words like AndyMc-IceMan,
A new and improved utan and often updating anticheat tool would the best we can do to keep the game as secure as we can if epic aint gonne help us AGAIN...
But the still the question remains who is gonne put in his time for making a good anticheat tool and keeps on updating it to "save" the community with it actually, do mind this is all when epic doesn't come up with anything of protection or whatever.. ( wich they wont in my eyes)
  #24  
Unread 9th September, 2006, 04:05 AM
AndyMc-IceMan AndyMc-IceMan is offline
Rampage
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 76
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShaD`
if epic aint gonne help us AGAIN...
LOL you played UT 1 or Unreal 2?

But yeah I think there tactics will lead to UT becomming a great blast in the past game and people will have a blast then go back to well maintained games.
Problem is with so many cheats available now days there are less people who learn the game proper like Q1 & UT1 was learnt. So now only a few can really play the game PROPER with PROPER skill that comes form there brain. In old UT in LMS it was more like a chess game when playing and people picked up on it real quick. Now most players just see cheats and go get them to compete or leave playing the game. Its a shame EPIC have always been out for the fast buck but tbh in the end some will retire very well off and someone else will be left to pick up the pieces. But as I said in a BFH topic, that sometimes these things need to happen for changes to come in place that get rid of the problems.
TBH the sooner the better then its over and done with.
Some problems will never vanish but gaming wil be back to how it was in the late days of q1 and early days of ut1. People cheated but not on the scale it is now.

Last edited by AndyMc-IceMan : 9th September, 2006 at 04:09 AM.
  #25  
Unread 9th September, 2006, 10:07 PM
_Lynx's Avatar
_Lynx _Lynx is offline
Killing Spree
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Moscow
Posts: 28
Default

Heh, as for regional lock, the system has to be very accurate. I'm from Moscow. My IP range 89.178.x.x belongs to a russian ISP Corbina Telecom. But quite a lot sites/programs consider that I'm from UK/Ireland. Recently Steam has introduced regional lock for games. Everything was ok, except for users of my ISP, cause Steam told them they're not from Russia but from UK. When I choose to search for local servers in xFire, all I get is UK servers with a ping that's not suitable for me. It's not a Vienna-Switzerland difference. Here we have opposite sides of Europe and about 3000+ kilometers miss. Will I be banned if I just decide to use another ISP which has IP that'll be properly detected as russian? Yes. And note that getting proper UT here is a real haemorrhoid, since Atari and most of e-shop services, that are ok for North America and West Europe, don't ship games here. UT2004 still 40 to 60 bucks here, and I payed 140 for mine limited edition SE.
__________________
Rarely seen, herdly heard, never caught.

Last edited by _Lynx : 9th September, 2006 at 10:10 PM.
  #26  
Unread 9th September, 2006, 10:39 PM
Wormbo's Avatar
Wormbo Wormbo is offline
out of order
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 3,383
Default

I don't know what kind of IP-to-country databases those services use, but GeoIP (that's what we use) returns "Russian Federation" for your IP.
__________________
Wormbo's UT/UT2004/UT3 mods | PlanetJailbreak | Unreal Wiki | Liandri Archives
Quote:
<@Mych|Lockdown> ...and the award for the most creative spelling of "Jailbreak" goes to ... "Gandis Jealbrake Server"
  #27  
Unread 10th September, 2006, 04:34 PM
MajorUrsa MajorUrsa is offline
Forum Newcomer
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 5
Thumbs up

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShiningSquirrel
This sounds like an excellent solution.
I agree completely. The fact that it does harm certain ISP's more than others is IMO only a good thing and will cause some action at last.
If ppl want to play on a UTAN server it is because they hate cheaters. They will actuallt love it to go through the extra hassle, and certainly if they will have 'secured' their ID by registering. I would!!

Ursa..
  #28  
Unread 10th September, 2006, 09:04 PM
_Lynx's Avatar
_Lynx _Lynx is offline
Killing Spree
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Moscow
Posts: 28
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wormbo
I don't know what kind of IP-to-country databases those services use, but GeoIP (that's what we use) returns "Russian Federation" for your IP.
Good news for me.
__________________
Rarely seen, herdly heard, never caught.
  #29  
Unread 10th September, 2006, 10:15 PM
AndyMc-IceMan AndyMc-IceMan is offline
Rampage
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 76
Default

I think most now have a choice of ISP's and would make the effort to switch if the ISP they was thinking of joining doesn't support there favorite game.
I think ISPs would make an effort to sort things there end if this way of joining a game was in force. You should petent it, if thats possible as it could catch on.
And something has to happen as SOOO many are cheating now, its the console kids generation comming into online games now, and I think where cheats are accepted on consoles most don't understand why its not the same or right to cheat in online multiplayer games.
Its only fun for the guy cheating at first then it becomes there life but they are the minority and the majority shouldnt have to put up with it. So if it means a few ISP's can't connect straight off for the majority to get a honest game then IMO its a problem I could live with more than the cheating.
And fair or not, given a choice the MAJORITY will take no cheats. cos tbh if someone said to you, "hey ya got no cheats in ya server but so and so can't get in!" then I'm not gonna let 20 cheaters in just so 1 person who doesn't cheat can get to play.
Besides as Wormbo said, he didnt get a UK ISP when he checked.

Last edited by AndyMc-IceMan : 10th September, 2006 at 10:17 PM.
  #30  
Unread 11th September, 2006, 08:46 AM
Keith_C Keith_C is offline
Dominating
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Uk.gif
Posts: 157
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PizzaMan
How about a modified server browser that gives comments or blocks servers based on a central server register? Well known servers like Titan etc could register their name and IP, and the server browser would then refuse to connect to the server if they dont match.

It would of course only work with clients that had this installed.

The browser could also keep a record and provide information about how long a server has been running on its current IP.
Kinda like that idea myself - I may have cause to change the IP of my ONS box in the upcoming months, and I'm nervous about how many players I will lose because they can't be sure that my new IP will actually be *me*, and not another harvester.
  #31  
Unread 11th September, 2006, 10:58 AM
Piglet Piglet is offline
Holy Shit!!
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: UK, South, Middle
Posts: 625
Default

Especially as the IP change will force a new server number on the stats page...

I guess the safe place to join from is the server monitor or the forum links, but would be great to be able to link UTAN account details to registered server name and IP.

It probably wouldn't be much of a change as there's already a UTAN account to server link in place.
__________________
Dogsbody at Miasma: Berserk Warfare (ONS and vCTF), Custom Freon, TAM, iCTF
Previously Admin at Titan Internet UK UT2004 Servers: (32 player ONS, Freon, RPG CTF)
  #32  
Unread 12th September, 2006, 12:02 AM
Wormbo's Avatar
Wormbo Wormbo is offline
out of order
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 3,383
Default

If a fake server doesn't run UTAN, we can't do anything. Also, Epic don't have direct access to the UTAN database, so the masterserver can't do anything either.
__________________
Wormbo's UT/UT2004/UT3 mods | PlanetJailbreak | Unreal Wiki | Liandri Archives
Quote:
<@Mych|Lockdown> ...and the award for the most creative spelling of "Jailbreak" goes to ... "Gandis Jealbrake Server"
  #33  
Unread 12th September, 2006, 05:09 AM
AndyMc-IceMan AndyMc-IceMan is offline
Rampage
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 76
Default

If ya got websites then put in ya server name "pw on site (ww.yousite.com), then from there advise them to use the link to connect to prevent entering a fake server, which u provide on ya site where they also get the password.
If ya run a server on a dynamic ip then use something like no-ip.com service or one of the others about.
Then people can use a simple link to connect to ya server all the time. This will help for now and get ya sites more hits and if people are that bothered about cheaters they will visit ya site. Yacould also have no-cheats in ya server name which my encourage them to visit ya site.

Its worth a try!
It will probably be quiet at first but you could give regulars the pw on messenger or somit and ya may need to sit in with a m8 to encourage players in.

When we had our server way back people would turn up and wait, soon as a few were in the rest followed and it was jammed all night with games as quick as 1 min in LMS with 8 lifes and about 12+ people.
Haha makes me laugh cos I did a map way back that was a small box with loads of spawns and weapons, it lasted about 40 seconds one time with 8 people all with 8 lives. Sounds silly but we just used to vote it in now and then just for a laugh, when some people were getting tense and stressed.

Those were the days.

Anyway just a thought.

Last edited by AndyMc-IceMan : 12th September, 2006 at 05:20 AM.
  #34  
Unread 12th September, 2006, 01:01 PM
Faction Faction is offline
Forum Newcomer
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 5
Default

As simple as this, if stuff like this doesnt start getting sorted, I am going to start avoiding epics products. If we can't have a cheater free enviroment, and epic are simply going to ignore the problem, I'll tell every game player I know of my decision and simply stay away from epic. There's no point in me buying epic products when this is obviously standard operating procedures for them.

I bet this wouldn't happen on my other usual game, guild wars, they'd sort it out in days.

Last edited by Faction : 12th September, 2006 at 01:06 PM.
  #35  
Unread 12th September, 2006, 06:18 PM
AndyMc-IceMan AndyMc-IceMan is offline
Rampage
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 76
Default

I think UT is a good game but not all can play it the way some can and for them its just another 3d shooter with less content then some others. So I think EPIC need's a new MD maybe. This won't happen untill they see low sales on the next UT. I don't think hyping a game up and delaying it loads works like it used too. Them Tricks are old now and people I think are wise to them. We have seen simular on many things like DVD movies, music and so on. But the proof is in the puddin, ID just have sooo many players and to get the most out of the game you have to buy it. They TBH have shown how it should be done and make others look poor. Also I know there games normally mean an upgrade but as machine specs move so does the performance of there current games. Constant updates for there games, even old ones also add's to there popularity. The way things are with UT it makes no difference to hpw your machine spec is. If u get in guys who want to slow things down and lag all to frack then you coudl have a ZXSpectrum and it woudln't make no difference.

But we do need help from EPIC in some ways as for an example, I played in Bee;s demo server last night with the demo version of UT on another machine and guys were cheating all night so I won a few then let them have a few to keep the botting from them down to a minimum. Then the more experienced cheaters came in and lagged the server to bits, slowed me to a snails speed. They are not much better players, they think they are but are not but then I sat back a few games, let them get big for there boots then played again and won and there was an awful lof of botting, I was having to avoid area's of the level as too many were outright botting me. Still I owned and won but I do get it bad and I'm used to it but I can imagine how just a touch of this is on guys who are just starting to get ok at playing and n00bs start laming them just because they can't compete, which is because they cheat and never learnt to play proper. But I think to myself its so out of order how EPIC abandon people, we see it in UT1, poor support, poor game updates and poor old them.

I think UTAN do a fantastic job but someone in a thread, maybe this one, said EPIC won't give out new keys because UTAN is 3rd party. To me thats sitting on both sides of the fence to suite themselfs and on top of everything else it looks obvious for EPIC's eventual fate and there own plans for there own future. But if they are saying UTAN is 3rd party and they will not give out new keys but UTAN controls who can and can't play an online game online then keys should not be banned. Then if that was the case then what would they do, people would abandon the game in flocks as it would me rediculous amounts of people cheating and not buying the game. So thats what I mean about sitting on both sides of the fence, totally contridicting themselfs and showing complete lack of respect for so many people who support them. If they haven't noticed this then maybe nows the time they did and maybe they too could become an ID insted of a one game company with hardly any players to its credit. ID have a vast range of games. Also I know a lot of people are into ut and hate quake but thats just a pride and follow the leader thing which most get over.

Oops, lots of text, there is too much to go throgh to cut it down so sorry in advance, but as this is the end of the post then post sorry.

Last edited by AndyMc-IceMan : 12th September, 2006 at 06:21 PM.
  #36  
Unread 14th October, 2006, 05:27 AM
LiKeMiKeS's Avatar
LiKeMiKeS LiKeMiKeS is offline
Forum Newcomer
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Central Cali !!!!
Posts: 4
Lightbulb Cheat Exploits

To all: Top notch posts!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Previous Posts
AndyMc-IceMan:
So if it means a few ISP's can't connect straight off for the majority to get a honest game then IMO its a problem I could live with more than the cheating.
mahe:
What will happen if the owner switches to another isp?
How are you able to proof that he/she is the owner of the CD-Key?
Wormbo:
If a fake server doesn't run UTAN, we can't do anything. Also, Epic don't have direct access to the UTAN database, so the masterserver can't do anything either.
Faction:
If we can't have a cheater free enviroment, and epic are simply going to ignore the problem, I'll tell every game player I know of my decision and simply stay away from epic.
// In answer to all of your posts:

Without some sort of DB/ID & verification sharing between UTAN & EPIC game servers, most of these solutions will not work completely, because of the way game engine editor hacks are used - if someone really wants to cheat and can - they will.

Unless you guys at UTAN can successfully rewrite the netcode verification system(without Epic's help) and post a version update were doomed to watch cheaters win.

If you could design a set of 2-3 verifiers that verify and watch the others back so to speak(like viralware), so if one gets patched the others don't work - or overwrite the odd one out to it's original state so it will work. Along with a protected memory scanner to check for known cheats(like a virus scanner with anti-cheat updates). Granted, the end result is bound to be longer connect times - oh well, such is the games ppl play!

Maybe even a bigger GUID(alot of work), probably even an engine patch which would have to come from Epic right!

Petition: yes, Boycott: maybe - Epic may be signing their own demise, Games without support!
__________________
Now is the time for uNrEaLiTy Where reality stops! & the fun begins!
Member of various Gaming & Graphics content forums.

Last edited by LiKeMiKeS : 14th October, 2006 at 05:54 AM.
  #37  
Unread 14th October, 2006, 11:54 AM
Shambler Shambler is offline
Holy Shit!!
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 875
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LiKeMiKeS
To all: Top notch posts!
Hmm, debatable.

What was the point in bumping this btw? Everything that's to be said has been said.
  #38  
Unread 14th October, 2006, 06:22 PM
url-sephiroth's Avatar
url-sephiroth url-sephiroth is offline
Dominating
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: uk
Posts: 120
Default

It is a odd topic to make your first post on...

And can i PLZ bump the idea of paying wormbo for more Anti-TCC i been told that last night there were 2 aimbotters on my server for over a hour....

(And yes i am on the newest version of Anti-TCC)
  #39  
Unread 16th October, 2006, 12:24 AM
LiKeMiKeS's Avatar
LiKeMiKeS LiKeMiKeS is offline
Forum Newcomer
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Central Cali !!!!
Posts: 4
Default Cheaters have gotten very sophisticated!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shambler
Hmm, debatable. What was the point in bumping this btw? Everything that's to be said has been said.
I agree, but! have you heard of any headway being made in this direction? I haven't! - everything that's been said is still going on!
It seems to me, the only way to stop the abuse on your server is to password protect it and send all your regular non-cheating/botting friends a password, with new players by invitation only!
Quote:
Originally Posted by url-sephiroth
It is a odd topic to make your first post on... And can i PLZ bump the idea of paying wormbo for more Anti-TCC i been told that last night there were 2 aimbotters on my server for over a hour.... (And yes i am on the newest version of Anti-TCC)
Odd! Maybe? Direct and to the point of whats degrading the gameplay of one of most popular & lucrative games around? YES!
I'd spend half my paycheck for a place where people could come and play fun games with each other !!!
As it is, cheaters have gotten very sophisticated! and have some of the best hacker/coders on their side - just so people can cheat! Like I said "If they can they will!"

I think the only way to circumvent the problem, is to best the competition by using viral(mutating) engine/netcode that changes everytime you run the game, at least until they come up with a way around it!

I've been playing Unreal since it first come out! I'm not about to stop now!
.,.
LM
__________________
Now is the time for uNrEaLiTy Where reality stops! & the fun begins!
Member of various Gaming & Graphics content forums.
  #40  
Unread 16th October, 2006, 07:19 AM
ARsEnAl51's Avatar
ARsEnAl51 ARsEnAl51 is offline
Holy Shit!!
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 800
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LiKeMiKeS
It seems to me, the only way to stop the abuse on your server is to password protect it and send all your regular non-cheating/botting friends a password, with new players by invitation only!
Password for... public servers? w00t!
 


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 06:44 AM.


 

All pages are copyright The Unreal Admins Page.
You may not copy any pages without our express permission.